Originally Posted by rodzm (Post 2113086)

Interesting, please keep it coming. I love experiments, by the way did the coin smell like eggs afterward, I imagine so

Originally Posted by RossL (Post 2113094)

sorry , but I have never understood the appeal of a toned silver coin.

toning = corrosion

albeit a very very thin layer of corrosion

Originally Posted by Twisted Avatar (Post 2113178)

Originally Posted by rodzm (Post 2113195)

Check the one i bought just a few days ago. Im alsmot sure it is artificial but the colors are awesome

Originally Posted by RossL (Post 2113094)

sorry , but I have never understood the appeal of a toned silver coin.

toning = corrosion

albeit a very very thin layer of corrosion

Originally Posted by newmisty (Post 2113518)

Just had the thought that it would be good to suspend the silver for even toning...

Any thoughts?

Originally Posted by goldwish (Post 2113555)

update: coin is very black straight on, but viewed at an angle is taking on blue tint around edges and red/pink center. 2 hours eh? having fun though :) :ok:

Originally Posted by madfranks (Post 2113557)

The colors on mine showed up a little before the two hour mark. Take a pic when you're done, I'm interested to see what yours looks like!

Originally Posted by rodzm (Post 2113603)

I started my own eperiment as well. I placed a 2008 Eagle, a 1964 Kennedy and a 1893 Columbian Expo half dollar which was partially toned. The Eagle is toning the fastest and is turning blue while the other ones are turning more of a yellow color. My best guess is that the other coins will turn colors later on while the Eagle turns at a faster rate.

I took a small bowl and let the coins rest on the edges essentially letting the sulfur get between both ends of the coin. My best guess is one side will have more color than the other since it is more exposed to the steam

Originally Posted by Junk Woody (Post 2113695)

Could you not place the coin on the smashed up HB egg to tone both sides?

or do you have to avoid contact with the reactant (egg)?

Originally Posted by newmisty (Post 2113444)

HAHA! That's so cool...feels like being a kid again doing some fun chemistry experiments.

I look forward to experimenting as well.

We should hold a little contest to see who can get the best(subjective) toning design from crushed warm eggs! What a hoot! lol

Originally Posted by oboshoe (Post 2114466)

Wow this is fun.

.

Originally Posted by HistoryStudent (Post 2115060)

Interesting how TONING can be a product of THOUGHT and MINOR effort - and some pay THROUGH the NOSE for it.

That nose "saying" came from the Bysantine Emporers who slit the NOSE of their previous ruler and sent them HIKING. Sometimes it also happened to the fellow who did it prior.

What comes around goes around - EVEN slitting the nose of your competitor who did it to his.

:thumb.aspx::111::111::111:

Originally Posted by rodzm (Post 2115141)

These are my results...not too happy with the Libertad but I guess with practice you can come up with some even toning

Originally Posted by Master_Ho (Post 2116100)

Great points!

And - as a collector of toned Morgans - this is why I am VERY CAREFUL unless I am buying them already graded!!!

I had one I bought on Ebay - the seller admitted franky, he had bought it and questined if it was real or artificially toned........we both agreed it was probably not natural.

I bought the Morgan for like $12 anyway - cause I was curious - and sent it in for grading to PCGS.

Here was my clever thinking. If it was AT then they'd send it back, no charge to me except shipping. If it was NT, then the coin would be worth a WHOLE LOT more than I had paid - so for me it was a no lose situation.

I submitted it 2 times to see - both times they graded it but gave it a "questionable toning" designation.........pretty much what I suspected.

I kept the coin and actually take it to classes to show them NT vs AT.......and my students love it!!!

So - tonight I am about to try a big family experiment!!! I am about to experiment with the egg system on some eagles and maybe a Philharmonic.

I intend to use three different amounts of yolk to compare!!! And my team here will see what happens! I can't take pics that are worth posting but I will let you know what we see........



PS - Gold doesn't tend to tarnish like silver - but it can't hurt to try it on a piece of bullion - if it sucks, you can always dip it - its only bullion!!


Cheers!!

:biggrin:

Originally Posted by HistoryStudent (Post 2116115)

I have 3 boxes of pre-1899s - MS64s Morgans graded by your PCGS - some lightly toned. Some MS65 and MS66 which cost a tad more then - I believe.

Sadly they are NOT the pretty rainbow babies - but some are interesting.

At first I thought they were UGLY back in 1994 when I bought them for $25 a piece. $500 a box. :ok:

Originally Posted by Master_Ho (Post 2116100)

I intend to use three different amounts of yolk to compare!!! And my team here will see what happens! I can't take pics that are worth posting but I will let you know what we see........

Originally Posted by Storm Chaser (Post 2117423)

Damn Camera ran out of batteries in the midst of the film. Not too happy with the bar's toning. Will try again with a SAE tonight and maybe add a bit of air in there too? I have been pressing the air out before I seal it.
Anyone think it would be a cool idea to cover the Silver with paper and tape and leave a design exposing the silver on the rest of the piece?

Originally Posted by madfranks (Post 2117180)

I could be wrong on this but I think it's actually the egg white that has the sulfur... good luck however you do it!

Here's a site I found with other ideas: http://www.coinsite.com/content/orig...c/p0000080.htm

Originally Posted by SLV>GLD (Post 2117997)

I'd be willing to bet money the highest concentration of sulfur is in the yolk. Elemental sulfur is yellow, folks.

Originally Posted by SLV>GLD (Post 2117997)

I'd be willing to bet money the highest concentration of sulfur is in the yolk. Elemental sulfur is yellow, folks.

Originally Posted by Junk Woody (Post 2118360)

My eggtempt :cry1:

Originally Posted by Iptuous (Post 2118026)

that's what i assumed, and so i only put mine in there with the yolk.
sat forever with barely any toning occurring.
so then i put some white in and it was turning dark within minutes.
now it could be that there was simply some saturation level that had to occur before the toning would show, but it was pretty compelling evidence to me that it is the white.
sniff the yolk separately and it doesn't smell nearly as sulphurous as the white alone.

Originally Posted by Master_Ho (Post 2119974)

Hi guys - just letting you know, I didn't poop put on ya......my research was side-lined by a really crappy flu - but I have been reading, and will run a few tests soon......

Anyone got any ideas about the condensation problem?

Originally Posted by Mr. Shiny (Post 2120770)

For a Vegan tone, try onion, brussel sprout or cabbage. All are high sulfur foods.

Originally Posted by Iptuous (Post 2120874)

she immediately suggested wrapping in cabbage. we tried it, and i think it did give a little bit more rainbow

Originally Posted by Master_Ho (Post 2120960)

Now, So I am clear - you are suggesting we try this JUST in cabbage, not in a baggie or with an egg???

For how long??

Originally Posted by madfranks (Post 2130342)

I took 1/4 cup of rubbing alcohol (50% alcohol by volume) and put in two drops of the liquid sulfur. I dropped one drop of the solution on the merc and made sure the liquid covered the full face of the coin. I let it sit for about 30 seconds and then I put a lighter to the coin, let it burn out (~10 seconds of burning), and look at this beautiful blue toning!

Originally Posted by lumpOgold (Post 2130370)

How does your house smell after that treatment? :wink:
I hope anyone that wants to repeat this is doing it outside! :smile:

Originally Posted by AGRO (Post 2114680)

For some reason i don't think you can achieve the same results as a "true" toned coin/bar.
Toning can be quite even in color and formation. It is usually not splotchy and sloppy looking. More like the bands of a rainbow...

...People that collect toned coins might know automatically that the toning on your initial coin pic is forced.

Originally Posted by Curmudgeonista (Post 2130519)

Serious collectors of toned coins should know the difference, but not everyone who likes them is always able to distinguish AT from NT... hence the ongoing debate over whether specific examples on the market are NT or AT.

Originally Posted by Iptuous (Post 2129489)

I bet...
does it smell as bad as those stink bombs that are the glass vials with yellow liquid in them?
hell, maybe that's what it is....

Originally Posted by HistoryStudent (Post 2171075)

TONING is sometimes really beautiful. But like AGE it might change over time.

So IMVHO paying extra for toning is like paying extra for PUFFING:

puffing n.

the exaggeration of the good points of a product, a business, real property, and the prospects for future rise in value, profits and growth. Since a certain amount of "puffing" can be expected of any salesman, it cannot be the basis of a lawsuit for fraud or breach of contract unless the exaggeration exceeds the reality. However, if the puffery includes outright lies or has no basis in fact ("Sears Roebuck is building next door to your store site") a legal action for rescission of the contract or for fraud against the seller is possible. (See: fraud)

Originally Posted by Master_Ho (Post 2178902)

The first line I agree with - and while playng with the toning is fun - there is no doubt in my mind that those toned over time are much more goregous.

On the second line - well, there are many things in life that are worth more because they are "different", "better", "more in demand" (liquor, food, cars, women, to name a few! *lol*) and while we can debate the relative merits of toned coins and their pricing (and some are terribly over priced, in my opinion).....the reality seems to be that toned, especially nicely colored rainbows, aged over time, are in demand and get the higher premiums.

And, I collect them because - not only are they in demand (in today's market, tho not always) and because I love them. I think of my collection as a small piece of history that I am merely a caretaker for until the time comes to sell. (They will not be making any more of these older coins!)

I hope, in time, the premiums hold and when the time comes to sell, the toning will fetch a few extra bucks! But I do have a limit as to high how I will pay above the value of the coin itself.

Cheers!

Originally Posted by HistoryStudent (Post 2181311)

I agree with you from your viewpoint. The most important thing we can learn in life is to see an issue from the other side.

Originally Posted by HistoryStudent (Post 2181311)

That said. I have my OWN (shall I can them silly for myself only) collectable coins:

Gold Ancients before and around 2000 years ago.
Pre-1799 Gold World Coins
Huge SILVER coins

That have a questionable future.

Originally Posted by HistoryStudent (Post 2181311)

I do by accident have a few slabbed silver US dollars that are toned.

Thanks for your profound input. I'm still nervous

http://www.moneymagik.com/scroll.jpg

about buying something that a chemical reaction caused and
the FOUR best coin company slabbers can NOT figure out (read 100% with a chemical paper type trail)
for sure if they HAVE a recent concocted personal coin doctor catalyst scheme or a 50 to 100 year long time in the making from
nature - so to speak.

:23_28_100s:

Originally Posted by Master_Ho (Post 2181406)

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I SO agree - its what I teach and its the only way to learn - its part of that Tao thing - all points have two sides and even here, I am not sure we are in real disagreement, To me its more shades of grey, as we try to second guess the future coin markets. In fact, I suspect, on the topic of numismatics, you and I agree more than most others around here - we're almost always tag-teaming these threads.........and I have learned so much for you, and you have stimulated some great discussions in the numismatic area.........which is, in part, what keeps me sticking around these days! <o:p></o:p>
<o:p></o:p>

<o:p></o:p>

I collect, in addition to other things, coins from around the world with dragons on them. Some have cost a bit, some a couple of bucks - I never think of that as part of my "investment" package - its my side hobby, a big cardboard box with lots of plastic envelopes with lots of dragon coins.........<o:p></o:p>
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And that is a hugely valid point - but, the graders (at least PCGS) do have people who seem to sort out the bulk of the "doctored coins", I had two I was sure were sent back as "questionable color" (no charge). Our buddy Q. David Bowers talks about natural and doctored toning, but also conceeds that the market loves those coins and, at least for the present, there does not seem to be any drop in interest in them.<o:p></o:p>
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And hey - if the market DOES ever go down - just crack and dip em!!<o:p></o:p>
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:biggrin:
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One of the interesting things to me about the coin show was looking at a lot of toned Morgans - and the prices they want for them - I noticed that mine seemed (to me and my party at least) as nice as the majority of the ones we saw ((for under five figured! *whew*)) That suiggested to me that I had chosen some good coins and, I told you I have a premium limit thats not very high, so I didn't pay too much and I suspect these will do well. Yours should do the same. I am not at all nervous about that..........and if gold and silver go as high as we think - they might be buying the coins for the metal alone and the hell with the toning....and we'd STILL do well!<o:p></o:p>
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However, in closing, I have to admit - I came home from the show somewhat depressed...........I mean, first of all - I never saw so much gold in one place at one time - slabs stacks feet high in all directions, hundreds of tables with hundreds, if not thousands of ounces for sale!!!!
<o:p></o:p>
I didn't realize how much more gold there was that I still had left to buy!!!! I thought I'd picked up most of it by now!<o:p></o:p>

*depressed*

*thinks - I sort of understand, now, those Avatar people who commit suicide after the movie because they can't live in a blue world*

And then, with so much of it out there - how the hell can they call it rare..........I mean, rare is like a dozen pieces of something.........rare is like a painting by DaVinci, or a albino Chinese. or a woman who buys YOU dinner before taking you home and having her way with you..........<o:p></o:p>
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Gold??? Pfffftttt...............about as rare as M&Ms.
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:sarcasm:

Originally Posted by HistoryStudent (Post 2181459)

You KINDA got me on the TONED 5 figures offered coins. That's the BUG-A-BOO

http://cgnow.com/cgnpics/HermieCamping.jpg

It's hard for me to go NUMISMATIC Camping paying five figures for albeit beautiful toned silver coins.

I have a heck of a HARD time paying over two grand for a 1/8 ounce of gold coin (like a $2.50 one) and when the Saints that I still needed went way over five grand I balked.

That said I believe that one can find so many UNDERVALUED items if one looks hard enough. So the problem is finding that specific defination to YOU or ME of what that UNDERVALUED numismatic item might be, right?

In other words what appears to be a great buy depending upon good guesstimates of the future herein albeit where we happen to live, right?

I see that 10 trillion redistrubute the wealth FED printing US dollars FINALLY hitting the marketplace this year. That should cause a little inflation. Inflation is NOT prices going way up - frankly, it's the dollar going way down - a FALLING FALLING DOLLAR.

Stagflationary HIDDEN Depression. :yes: